Just got it as a matter of fact. Went without for over a year. It was costing a fortune & had to cancel it. Went through Lake Plains (Harvester Ave.) & thankfully we qualified for Family Health Plus. Finally I can get get back to the eye doctor. No DENTAL though...bummer.
Why is that?
The following list of salaries for health insurance company CEO's was taken from a Seton Hall sponsored blog. They found the salaries from the companies' SEC filings for 2008:
Aetna, Ronald A. Williams: $24,300,112
Cigna, H. Edward Hanway: $12,236,740
Coventry, Dale Wolf: $9,047,469
Health Net, Jay Gellert: $4,425,355
Humana, Michael McCallister: $4,764,309
U. Health Group, Stephen J. Hemsley: $3,241,042
Wellpoint, Angela Braly: $9,844,212
This is one reason we need change. These folks made this money because the business profitted. And it profitted by cutting corners, denying services, and raising premiums.
Something is wrong with a society that allows greed to come before health. If other nations in the western civilized world do it, why don't we? The health care business should be NOT FOR PROFIT, thus eliminating the need to worry so much about the bottom line, and focus more attention on becoming a healthier nation.
Bud, thank you for standing up on this issue. You've really hit the nail on the head as far as I'm concerned. People's health should not be a for-profit enterprise, period.
Those salaries are obscene. A million a year would be bad enough, maybe justifiable, but 24 million is plain greed. I think I'd be embarrassed to admit I made that much money off of sick people.
I am with Aetna. It's the only option offered by my employer. I can verify they are brutal with denying claims and nickel and diming with the co-pays and deductibles. I am getting closer and closer to wanting a single-payer system. Too bad it would have to be run by politicians who'll try to get their grubby little fingers in the pie constantly, if we could somehow keep the special interests out, it could work. By the way, the HHS Secretary, the VA Secretary and the Defense Secretary make $180,100.00 per year and oversee Medicare/Medicaid which I believe has more customers, 45 million, than any of the insurance companies. VA has about 7.8 million in its health care system. The DoD has around 1.5 million on active duty. The government may not be overly efficient, but when it comes to responsibility versus compensation, it's no contest.
How ironic...I just received a notice, along with new cards, that my insurance provider has been changed yet again. Let's see, that's 4 times in 3 years, and I'm right back with BCBS. This is frustrating. My wife and I have seen multiple doctors over the last year, and it's a hassle to have to provide new info to all. Not only that, but the doctor's aren't always included. My wife has a serious back surgery coming up, and I don't know if either surgeon working on her accepts our new coverage! With a NFP system, my employer wouldn't be shopping around constantly for the best deal, because money isn't part of the equation any longer.
And Dave, I don't know about you, but I could live quite well on 175,000 a year, don't you think?
I think I'd like to give it a try. Also, if we had a national health program, small business owners wouldn't have to carry the medical part of workman's compensation insurance, & we wouldn't need the medical portion of our auto and homeowner's insurance. Unfortunately all the personal injury lawyers would have to find something else to bilk.
How about NYS, Lords of government taxing us to death. Out of an over $700 Christmas Bonus, we end up with $400. This to me is very unfair. Over 30% taken out in taxes. Reform? Its beyond that. This farce has gone on so long, theres little hope for better. Unless you are willing push for reform, and "Take a Stand", it seems hopeless.
I went to a seminar at Hyland Hospital yesterday. It was 3 hours of very interesting discussion. One thing I did notice, when talking about health insurance, was the frustration on the peoples faces. I have BLUE EPO, others that had this MVP( the old Prefered Care) were the most upset. They are inposing some pretty rediculious changes, and stipulations for coverage, that I think are Bull. The insured pay for what?? To be unable to utilize their insurance? These Bigwigs are makeing WAY TO MUCH money on the backs of the middle class.
I have also, over the last few weeks, watched closely the process of putting a parent in a nursing home. Talk about needed reform. To have to hand over your whole lifes savings, all you've worked for, property, to be taken away, and to have your insurance deny coverage, being forced to take highly taxed, maximum draws on their 401K, and Kodak stock, is a Bitter Pill. Especially for my mother. Just a long paper trail, of money grabbers. The process needs reform.
Just venting
My wife and I have MVP. Our policy went up 33% for this coming year. Did our coverage go up? Nope.
Hey what about all the poor public employees though? They might not get a 2% raise!!!! I'm so sick of hearing how bad the public sector has been hit! I know Public Employees who pay less than $100 per month for a family plan!!!!!
My company had a rough year, but my unit did AWESOME! I made the company a lot of money! Did I get a raise? Nope, but I still have a job. Does my Healthcare suck? Yep, but I have it...For now.
Insurance industry executives make way too much money and the head of the VA may only make $180,000, but he will have a huge pension and his health care paid for on us for the rest of his life! Both are enjoying their lives while we are struggle to makes ends meet between paying taxes and their premiums!
I'm not even remotely concerned how much money the CEO makes as it really is an insignificant number compared to haw many billions of dollars each insurance company is dealing with. $24million sounds like a lot and it is but in the bigger picture, those salaries aren't the problem. They aren't affecting why you and I are being nickel and dimed to death with co-pays and other costs not covered.
I recently had my 3rd bout with kidney stones and needed numerous doctor visits, cystoscopies and a lithotripsy procedure. I'm still receiving itemized bills with what the insurance will and will not cover. There always seems to be something in the $100 to $150 range on every bill that insurance says they're not responsible for.
I've been covered by health insurance since I started working full time in 1983 and this is the first major expense to them for me. Why I'm not covered in full is a mystery. Anyone on welfare would be covered and any inmate would be covered in full.
The real problem is that these insurance companies try to maximize profits so that shareholders can get a healthy dividend check at the end of the year. The CEO's salary really has nothing to do with health care costs. I agree their salary is absurd but it's not the problem at all.
Health care should be a quality of life issue. If everyone is kept healthy, they can minimize costs to health care providers and maximize their ability to pay less expensive premiums by being able to go to work every day.
There's a bigger contributing factor to why insurance premiums are so high. Look around you when you are out and about. I see way more fat bodies than I do healthy bodies. How many smokers do I see even though we all know that smoking is probably the worst thing you can do to yourself. Being overweight contributes to diabetes, arthritis, heart disease and higher health care expenses.
An employer pays the same coverage rate for unhealthy employees as they do for people who take care of themselves. Is that fair? Probably not. Just like driving, good drivers pay lower premiums but it doesn't apply to health coverage. I'm baffled by this.
Do you brush your teeth twice or three times a day AND floss? If not, you're probably contributing to your own heart disease and arthritis. It's a proven fact that poor dental hygiene has a huge impact on your health. It causes chronic, systemic inflammation. Are all of you taking responsibility for your own health or are you just relying on your doctor and their prescription pad?
Bud, thanks for the notable salary information there, those people defiantly make way to much.
I had insurance for a while and no longer carry it for a few reasons.
1, Way expensive. Medical insurance would put the most of us in the poor house while trying to balance it with the regular bills.
2. I don't qualify for Family Health Plus even though I have a child and don't make more than 1400 in an average month (they came up with some wacky figured and denied it).
3. After leaving my previous employer I went though 2 months of phone calls, text messages, and emails to find out where the cobra paperwork was at only to get in contact with the chamber rep and have her tell me that the day that I called was 1 day to late to file... bummer.
Health insurance is way to expensive for some of us to get and make ends meat for our families. Even on an employer plan they can take a very large chunk out of your paycheck leaving you with little or nothing to pay the bills during the month.
Why do we pay into this stuff if we can't benefit from it when there is a time when we actually need it?
Doug, the point I got from Bud's posting the CEO salaries was the same as what you said, the companies are making a boatload of money if they can pay the head cheese that much. Their payplans probably are tied to profits. I know what you're saying, I have paid in to the system for 30 plus years and didn't really use much until about 2 years ago. When I was a kid, my parents had major hospitalization insurance. Doctor visits and check-ups etc, they paid for at the time. You can't do that any more Now, with the legal issues they have to deal with, a doctor wants to get all kinds of tests and, in my opinion, over-treat in order to protect themselves for malpractice. It's become such a bog that I don't think it can be straightened out. Congress is supposed to be working on a reform plan, we all know that'll be a bigger mess. I think going totally socialist on this issue is the only way to clean it up. If this were to happen, as an overweight, lazy guy I'm not happy that you'll probably get your wish and the government health care person I'll be dealing with will probably force me into a better diet and exercise. An interesting take on this can be seen at the end of the film "Freedom to Fascism" It'll stink for some of us.
Gee. Just a month ago, this crew was ready to tar and feather Obama for suggesting we need an alternative to private health insurance. Did someone spike the eggnog?
I think that there are finally enough facts out there to properly dilute all the bullcrap.
Couple that with the fact that this is the time of year that health care premiums are raised and you have a great opportunity for folks to get on the right side of this issue.
I believe I said then that the government should either go all the way to total healthcare or get completely out of it, anything in between the 2 extremes will screw the middle class. Half measures and compromises are not going to get it with this problem.
-13% uninsured on this un-scientific poll, to me, is unacceptable.
-Brian's story of red tape and denials is unacceptable.
-Insurance CEO's racking in million dollar salaries, while Brian's family goes without health insurance is unacceptable.
-It's unacceptable that people WITH insurance are going bankrupt and losing their homes or need to rely on a kind community for bake sales, counter top coin jars and jamborees to cover the expenses that the insurance companies deny.
-The Democrats, who promised reform, started from a place of compromise (when they should have started with single payer), moved to a second compromise, and now are compromising once again -- TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE!
-A gift of 30 million new mandated customers for the insurance complex is not reform. It's a whole lot more insurance exec's racking up multi-million dollar salaries by denying more of the population coverage.
The Democrats, who promised reform, started from a place of compromise (when they should have started with single payer), moved to a second compromise, and now are compromising once again -- TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE!
Agreed! But Lorie, they didn't start with single payer, and you and I know why...lobbyists, insurance companies,and pharmaceutical makers. Oh, let's not forget the greedy LAWYERS! Funny how DC is chock full of them, elephants and donkeys alike.
And the idea the government is going to penalize you if you do not purchase health insurance is Chicago thuggery politics at it's best. At no time in the history of our nation has a citizen been MANDATED to buy something, and that is what is included in this bill.
I wholeheartedly agree with Dave, all or nothing. Enough pandering to special interests. Mr. Obama, and all who are trying to steamroll this effort, need to take a deep breath, and start from scratch after the new year.
Bud, I was in DC and I saw the lobbyists scurrying in and out of all the congressional offices. We even engaged one in conversation on the elevator. I still had faith that the needs of the American people would win over all that money. They've spent a billion dollars to kill this, but the representatives that do their bidding in exchange for campaign funds are just as bad. Senators are no different than sports stars with advertising contracts -- except they don't where a cap with a logo displayed on it. They might as well, though.
I don't like that mandate, Bud. I wanted single payer. The robust public option was a good second choice and maybe a beginning. The medicare buy in sounded expensive for people that can least afford it, but medicare is single payer with very low overhead so I was trying to get on board and hope for affordable premiums. And whatever the next watered down version turns out to be will be worse yet. This is not reform. Watch the stock of the insurance cartels rise in the aftermath.
One advantage to single-payer/public option that I have yet to see argued... wouldn't small businesses (and large as well) feel liberated if they didn't have to provide, fund and/or account for employee insurance benefits? It would seem to me that (despite the U. S. Chamber of Commerce position) every business owner (except health insurance companies) would be thrilled to dispossess themselves of that obligation. ...And wouldn't the employees be equally thrilled to accept the liberated expense in their take-home pay? Or could that be construed as socialism?
It seems that the only businesses the US Chamber is concerned with are pharma and insurance companies. Many small businesses cannot afford to insure employees anymore.
This bill does give tax breaks to small businesses, closes the medicare donut hole, stops denials for pre-existing conditions and has some other good reform measures.
C.M. said "wouldn't small businesses (and large as well) feel liberated if they didn't have to provide, fund and/or account for employee insurance benefits?"
C.M.- they would still be funding it through the taxes that will skyrocket! This needs to be addressed as fixing and conforming an existing system (medicare/medicaid) and finding a way to fund it without spending 1.2 trillion a year.
Good points C.M. and Bud. I'd like to see the onus taken off business to provide most of the cost of their employees health insurance. I like how Sen. Nelson says he'll agree to be the 60th vote if they come to terms about abortion, and doesn't mention the extra medicare/medicaid money his state is getting. I think it was Pres. Reagan who said the 2nd oldest profession is a lot like the 1st oldest. B O H I C A (Bend Over Here It Comes Again)
Bud, don't you think that the 300 and 400% premium increases have the same impact on businesses? Frankly, if the public funded health care proposal operates as a non-profit, it should cost less. Second, playing devil's advocate, if it doesn't cost less; this is merely a shell game with the expenses directed to a different account. Third, we haven't even touched on the specifics of funding the public option. Tax reform is next on the agenda.
And, personally, I do not think that businesses should be taxed- nor do I think they should have privileges reserved in the Constitution for citizens. Those individuals who work for or own the company should pay the taxes. Stockholders who profit from the company should pay taxes. The law should recongize those who comprise the corporation- not the entity of the corporation.
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
That's the preamble. Nowhere does it mention corporations; it says, "people." The notion that corporations can manipulate elections, politicians and policy is unconstitutional- not to mention immoral.
The essense of making healthcare public is that we-the-people will have a voice in the management of our healthcare system. Currently we are not only victims of illnesss; we are victims of arbitrary decisions pertaining to our care.
Just got it as a matter of
Just got it as a matter of fact. Went without for over a year. It was costing a fortune & had to cancel it. Went through Lake Plains (Harvester Ave.) & thankfully we qualified for Family Health Plus. Finally I can get get back to the eye doctor. No DENTAL though...bummer.
Why is that?
Don't feel too badly. I pay
Don't feel too badly. I pay the full shot for my insurance and don't have eye coverage or dental either. $12,000 a year for two people.
The following list of
The following list of salaries for health insurance company CEO's was taken from a Seton Hall sponsored blog. They found the salaries from the companies' SEC filings for 2008:
Aetna, Ronald A. Williams: $24,300,112
Cigna, H. Edward Hanway: $12,236,740
Coventry, Dale Wolf: $9,047,469
Health Net, Jay Gellert: $4,425,355
Humana, Michael McCallister: $4,764,309
U. Health Group, Stephen J. Hemsley: $3,241,042
Wellpoint, Angela Braly: $9,844,212
This is one reason we need change. These folks made this money because the business profitted. And it profitted by cutting corners, denying services, and raising premiums.
Something is wrong with a society that allows greed to come before health. If other nations in the western civilized world do it, why don't we? The health care business should be NOT FOR PROFIT, thus eliminating the need to worry so much about the bottom line, and focus more attention on becoming a healthier nation.
Bud, thank you for standing
Bud, thank you for standing up on this issue. You've really hit the nail on the head as far as I'm concerned. People's health should not be a for-profit enterprise, period.
Those salaries are obscene.
Those salaries are obscene. A million a year would be bad enough, maybe justifiable, but 24 million is plain greed. I think I'd be embarrassed to admit I made that much money off of sick people.
I am with Aetna. It's the
I am with Aetna. It's the only option offered by my employer. I can verify they are brutal with denying claims and nickel and diming with the co-pays and deductibles. I am getting closer and closer to wanting a single-payer system. Too bad it would have to be run by politicians who'll try to get their grubby little fingers in the pie constantly, if we could somehow keep the special interests out, it could work. By the way, the HHS Secretary, the VA Secretary and the Defense Secretary make $180,100.00 per year and oversee Medicare/Medicaid which I believe has more customers, 45 million, than any of the insurance companies. VA has about 7.8 million in its health care system. The DoD has around 1.5 million on active duty. The government may not be overly efficient, but when it comes to responsibility versus compensation, it's no contest.
How ironic...I just received
How ironic...I just received a notice, along with new cards, that my insurance provider has been changed yet again. Let's see, that's 4 times in 3 years, and I'm right back with BCBS. This is frustrating. My wife and I have seen multiple doctors over the last year, and it's a hassle to have to provide new info to all. Not only that, but the doctor's aren't always included. My wife has a serious back surgery coming up, and I don't know if either surgeon working on her accepts our new coverage! With a NFP system, my employer wouldn't be shopping around constantly for the best deal, because money isn't part of the equation any longer.
And Dave, I don't know about you, but I could live quite well on 175,000 a year, don't you think?
I think I'd like to give it a
I think I'd like to give it a try. Also, if we had a national health program, small business owners wouldn't have to carry the medical part of workman's compensation insurance, & we wouldn't need the medical portion of our auto and homeowner's insurance. Unfortunately all the personal injury lawyers would have to find something else to bilk.
How about NYS, Lords of
How about NYS, Lords of government taxing us to death. Out of an over $700 Christmas Bonus, we end up with $400. This to me is very unfair. Over 30% taken out in taxes. Reform? Its beyond that. This farce has gone on so long, theres little hope for better. Unless you are willing push for reform, and "Take a Stand", it seems hopeless.
I went to a seminar at Hyland Hospital yesterday. It was 3 hours of very interesting discussion. One thing I did notice, when talking about health insurance, was the frustration on the peoples faces. I have BLUE EPO, others that had this MVP( the old Prefered Care) were the most upset. They are inposing some pretty rediculious changes, and stipulations for coverage, that I think are Bull. The insured pay for what?? To be unable to utilize their insurance? These Bigwigs are makeing WAY TO MUCH money on the backs of the middle class.
I have also, over the last few weeks, watched closely the process of putting a parent in a nursing home. Talk about needed reform. To have to hand over your whole lifes savings, all you've worked for, property, to be taken away, and to have your insurance deny coverage, being forced to take highly taxed, maximum draws on their 401K, and Kodak stock, is a Bitter Pill. Especially for my mother. Just a long paper trail, of money grabbers. The process needs reform.
Just venting
My wife and I have MVP. Our
My wife and I have MVP. Our policy went up 33% for this coming year. Did our coverage go up? Nope.
Hey what about all the poor public employees though? They might not get a 2% raise!!!! I'm so sick of hearing how bad the public sector has been hit! I know Public Employees who pay less than $100 per month for a family plan!!!!!
My company had a rough year, but my unit did AWESOME! I made the company a lot of money! Did I get a raise? Nope, but I still have a job. Does my Healthcare suck? Yep, but I have it...For now.
Insurance industry executives make way too much money and the head of the VA may only make $180,000, but he will have a huge pension and his health care paid for on us for the rest of his life! Both are enjoying their lives while we are struggle to makes ends meet between paying taxes and their premiums!
What a deal!
I'm not even remotely
I'm not even remotely concerned how much money the CEO makes as it really is an insignificant number compared to haw many billions of dollars each insurance company is dealing with. $24million sounds like a lot and it is but in the bigger picture, those salaries aren't the problem. They aren't affecting why you and I are being nickel and dimed to death with co-pays and other costs not covered.
I recently had my 3rd bout with kidney stones and needed numerous doctor visits, cystoscopies and a lithotripsy procedure. I'm still receiving itemized bills with what the insurance will and will not cover. There always seems to be something in the $100 to $150 range on every bill that insurance says they're not responsible for.
I've been covered by health insurance since I started working full time in 1983 and this is the first major expense to them for me. Why I'm not covered in full is a mystery. Anyone on welfare would be covered and any inmate would be covered in full.
The real problem is that these insurance companies try to maximize profits so that shareholders can get a healthy dividend check at the end of the year. The CEO's salary really has nothing to do with health care costs. I agree their salary is absurd but it's not the problem at all.
Health care should be a quality of life issue. If everyone is kept healthy, they can minimize costs to health care providers and maximize their ability to pay less expensive premiums by being able to go to work every day.
There's a bigger contributing factor to why insurance premiums are so high. Look around you when you are out and about. I see way more fat bodies than I do healthy bodies. How many smokers do I see even though we all know that smoking is probably the worst thing you can do to yourself. Being overweight contributes to diabetes, arthritis, heart disease and higher health care expenses.
An employer pays the same coverage rate for unhealthy employees as they do for people who take care of themselves. Is that fair? Probably not. Just like driving, good drivers pay lower premiums but it doesn't apply to health coverage. I'm baffled by this.
Do you brush your teeth twice or three times a day AND floss? If not, you're probably contributing to your own heart disease and arthritis. It's a proven fact that poor dental hygiene has a huge impact on your health. It causes chronic, systemic inflammation. Are all of you taking responsibility for your own health or are you just relying on your doctor and their prescription pad?
Bud, thanks for the notable
Bud, thanks for the notable salary information there, those people defiantly make way to much.
I had insurance for a while and no longer carry it for a few reasons.
1, Way expensive. Medical insurance would put the most of us in the poor house while trying to balance it with the regular bills.
2. I don't qualify for Family Health Plus even though I have a child and don't make more than 1400 in an average month (they came up with some wacky figured and denied it).
3. After leaving my previous employer I went though 2 months of phone calls, text messages, and emails to find out where the cobra paperwork was at only to get in contact with the chamber rep and have her tell me that the day that I called was 1 day to late to file... bummer.
Health insurance is way to expensive for some of us to get and make ends meat for our families. Even on an employer plan they can take a very large chunk out of your paycheck leaving you with little or nothing to pay the bills during the month.
Why do we pay into this stuff if we can't benefit from it when there is a time when we actually need it?
Doug, the point I got from
Doug, the point I got from Bud's posting the CEO salaries was the same as what you said, the companies are making a boatload of money if they can pay the head cheese that much. Their payplans probably are tied to profits. I know what you're saying, I have paid in to the system for 30 plus years and didn't really use much until about 2 years ago. When I was a kid, my parents had major hospitalization insurance. Doctor visits and check-ups etc, they paid for at the time. You can't do that any more Now, with the legal issues they have to deal with, a doctor wants to get all kinds of tests and, in my opinion, over-treat in order to protect themselves for malpractice. It's become such a bog that I don't think it can be straightened out. Congress is supposed to be working on a reform plan, we all know that'll be a bigger mess. I think going totally socialist on this issue is the only way to clean it up. If this were to happen, as an overweight, lazy guy I'm not happy that you'll probably get your wish and the government health care person I'll be dealing with will probably force me into a better diet and exercise. An interesting take on this can be seen at the end of the film "Freedom to Fascism" It'll stink for some of us.
Gee. Just a month ago, this
Gee. Just a month ago, this crew was ready to tar and feather Obama for suggesting we need an alternative to private health insurance. Did someone spike the eggnog?
I think that there are
I think that there are finally enough facts out there to properly dilute all the bullcrap.
Couple that with the fact that this is the time of year that health care premiums are raised and you have a great opportunity for folks to get on the right side of this issue.
I believe I said then that
I believe I said then that the government should either go all the way to total healthcare or get completely out of it, anything in between the 2 extremes will screw the middle class. Half measures and compromises are not going to get it with this problem.
-13% uninsured on this
-13% uninsured on this un-scientific poll, to me, is unacceptable.
-Brian's story of red tape and denials is unacceptable.
-Insurance CEO's racking in million dollar salaries, while Brian's family goes without health insurance is unacceptable.
-It's unacceptable that people WITH insurance are going bankrupt and losing their homes or need to rely on a kind community for bake sales, counter top coin jars and jamborees to cover the expenses that the insurance companies deny.
-The Democrats, who promised reform, started from a place of compromise (when they should have started with single payer), moved to a second compromise, and now are compromising once again -- TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE!
-A gift of 30 million new mandated customers for the insurance complex is not reform. It's a whole lot more insurance exec's racking up multi-million dollar salaries by denying more of the population coverage.
The Democrats, who promised
The Democrats, who promised reform, started from a place of compromise (when they should have started with single payer), moved to a second compromise, and now are compromising once again -- TOTALLY UNACCEPTABLE!
Agreed! But Lorie, they didn't start with single payer, and you and I know why...lobbyists, insurance companies,and pharmaceutical makers. Oh, let's not forget the greedy LAWYERS! Funny how DC is chock full of them, elephants and donkeys alike.
And the idea the government is going to penalize you if you do not purchase health insurance is Chicago thuggery politics at it's best. At no time in the history of our nation has a citizen been MANDATED to buy something, and that is what is included in this bill.
I wholeheartedly agree with Dave, all or nothing. Enough pandering to special interests. Mr. Obama, and all who are trying to steamroll this effort, need to take a deep breath, and start from scratch after the new year.
Bud, I was in DC and I saw
Bud, I was in DC and I saw the lobbyists scurrying in and out of all the congressional offices. We even engaged one in conversation on the elevator. I still had faith that the needs of the American people would win over all that money. They've spent a billion dollars to kill this, but the representatives that do their bidding in exchange for campaign funds are just as bad. Senators are no different than sports stars with advertising contracts -- except they don't where a cap with a logo displayed on it. They might as well, though.
I don't like that mandate, Bud. I wanted single payer. The robust public option was a good second choice and maybe a beginning. The medicare buy in sounded expensive for people that can least afford it, but medicare is single payer with very low overhead so I was trying to get on board and hope for affordable premiums. And whatever the next watered down version turns out to be will be worse yet. This is not reform. Watch the stock of the insurance cartels rise in the aftermath.
One advantage to
One advantage to single-payer/public option that I have yet to see argued... wouldn't small businesses (and large as well) feel liberated if they didn't have to provide, fund and/or account for employee insurance benefits? It would seem to me that (despite the U. S. Chamber of Commerce position) every business owner (except health insurance companies) would be thrilled to dispossess themselves of that obligation. ...And wouldn't the employees be equally thrilled to accept the liberated expense in their take-home pay? Or could that be construed as socialism?
It seems that the only
It seems that the only businesses the US Chamber is concerned with are pharma and insurance companies. Many small businesses cannot afford to insure employees anymore.
....And the results are very good for anyone owning stocks in insurance companies. Stocks are responding with a 52 week high --
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB100014240527487039549045745963834264866…
This bill does give tax breaks to small businesses, closes the medicare donut hole, stops denials for pre-existing conditions and has some other good reform measures.
C.M. said "wouldn't small
C.M. said "wouldn't small businesses (and large as well) feel liberated if they didn't have to provide, fund and/or account for employee insurance benefits?"
C.M.- they would still be funding it through the taxes that will skyrocket! This needs to be addressed as fixing and conforming an existing system (medicare/medicaid) and finding a way to fund it without spending 1.2 trillion a year.
Good points C.M. and Bud. I'd
Good points C.M. and Bud. I'd like to see the onus taken off business to provide most of the cost of their employees health insurance. I like how Sen. Nelson says he'll agree to be the 60th vote if they come to terms about abortion, and doesn't mention the extra medicare/medicaid money his state is getting. I think it was Pres. Reagan who said the 2nd oldest profession is a lot like the 1st oldest. B O H I C A (Bend Over Here It Comes Again)
Bud, don't you think that the
Bud, don't you think that the 300 and 400% premium increases have the same impact on businesses? Frankly, if the public funded health care proposal operates as a non-profit, it should cost less. Second, playing devil's advocate, if it doesn't cost less; this is merely a shell game with the expenses directed to a different account. Third, we haven't even touched on the specifics of funding the public option. Tax reform is next on the agenda.
And, personally, I do not think that businesses should be taxed- nor do I think they should have privileges reserved in the Constitution for citizens. Those individuals who work for or own the company should pay the taxes. Stockholders who profit from the company should pay taxes. The law should recongize those who comprise the corporation- not the entity of the corporation.
We the People of the United States, in Order to form a more perfect Union, establish Justice, insure domestic Tranquility, provide for the common defence, promote the general Welfare, and secure the Blessings of Liberty to ourselves and our Posterity, do ordain and establish this Constitution for the United States of America.
That's the preamble. Nowhere does it mention corporations; it says, "people." The notion that corporations can manipulate elections, politicians and policy is unconstitutional- not to mention immoral.
The essense of making healthcare public is that we-the-people will have a voice in the management of our healthcare system. Currently we are not only victims of illnesss; we are victims of arbitrary decisions pertaining to our care.