With a state budget five weeks late and a $9.5 billion budget gap, Assemblyman Steve Hawley found a debate on seahorse protection legislation just a bit ridiculous.
Hawley voted no on the bill just as a matter of protest.
“The dysfunction in Albany has reached a breaking point, and today’s debate on seahorse legislation is a prime example of that," Hawley said in a news release. "Despite the fact I want to save my seahorse friends, I voted no on this bill in protest because of the sheer lunacy of its timing during this fiscal crisis. Over the last four weeks, the Assembly Majority has introduced trivial legislation, while continuing to send the rank-and-file members home after only a couple days of work.”
WGRB out of Albany spoke to the bill's sponsor:
The sponsor of the seahorse bill, Steve Englebright of Long Island, says this is important legislation to protect seahorses off Long Island that are collected for the aquarium industry, and that it would be malpractice for the Assembly not to work on other bills while waiting for a budget deal.
Hawley said he's frustrated with the lack of progress on a budget.
"Since April 1, four emergency budget extenders have been put in place, and there are no concrete plans for a budget to be passed anytime soon," Hawley said.
Got to agree with Steve on
Got to agree with Steve on that. The Legislature is like Nero, fiddling while Rome burns. I'm waiting for one of them to say"Let them eat cake". If I can think of any other historical references, I'll comment later. What a bunch of jerks.
Maybe if Mr. Hawley was a
Maybe if Mr. Hawley was a part of the solution we wouldn't have to read about these little squabbles.
For the record, I don't give a damn about the seahorses, I DO give a damn about the budget. Hawley is admittedly ineffective in Albany; he says it's because he's a member of the minority party, but we all know that Albany has been broken under the rule of both major parties. It's time to elect someone who has the guts to be effective whether he's in the majority or not.
People always tell me Hawley is too popular to beat in an election. I disagree. Steve Hawley is our Paris Hilton, he's popular for being popular and he's famous for being famous.
Steve, do something useful or vacate your seat; we're not paying you $70,000/ year to bitch about seahorses.
The time has come to bring
The time has come to bring someone to Albany who has the integrity and knowledge to make a difference in our state's government.
We need fresh, intelligent, well thought out solutions instead of the same old excuses for not getting things done.
Chris, Bea, I assume that
Chris, Bea, I assume that since a Democrat could never win the seat, you're now throwing your support behind a conservative Republican challenger?
Howard said "I assume that
Howard said "I assume that since a Democrat could never win the seat"
Howard, they said that about the 29th congressional district, and look what they ended up with!
Didn't I just say that Hawley
Didn't I just say that Hawley CAN be beat Howard? This district has been represented by conservative Republicans just about forever and we're no better off than we were 10, 15, 20 years ago. Why would we want more of the same?
Folks on your site and all over the place keep saying that it's time to throw out the incumbents, that most of the current representatives in Albany are just a part of the wallpaper and it's time for a remodel. I'm saying that the 139th should lead the way.
Chris, let me paint a little
Chris, let me paint a little scenario for you.
Let's say you find a Democrat to run against Hawley and you start to get traction with the campaign and have a chance to win. It's at that point, Albany Democrats step in with the final infusion of money for all the mailers and TV commercials in the final days of the campaign.
That pushes your candidate over the top.
Now your candidate is beholding to Albany Democrats. They own him. And if he or she wants Democratic funding again in two years, he better toe the line and walk the talk. If not, Albany Democrats are going to want to put their money where they think it's more useful, because an "independent minded" representative would be a hindrance to them. My God, such a representative might actually vote with the Republicans on occasion, especially if he were representative his district (it seems from past discussions, Democrats on this site think you should vote as the district wants you to vote, not your own mind). So Albany Democrats would be very dissatisfied with a Democrat from this district, if one actually won.
So the new rep has two choices -- remain independent and almost surely lose the next election for lack of funds, or sell his soul to Albany Democrats.
And how do I know this is true? Because I saw it happen first hand when I went to work for a Democrat who won a Republic district in California (the GOP margin there, btw wasn't nearly as large as it is in this district).
What I'm saying is in no way partisan, because I'd say the same thing if we were talking about Republicans against Democrats -- electing a Democrat in this district isn't going to change one damn thing. Voting for a Democrat against any Republican, just as voting for any Republican against any Democrat is 100 percent absolutely the same as voting for an incumbent.
Speaking of reality, I also have a question for you: If you're not in the majority, how do you get anything done. Please explain that to me. How can you "have the guts to be effective" when you're sitting in your office by yourself with no way to muster 76 votes?
So, is the answer to keep the
So, is the answer to keep the status quo?
I'd rather see the independent lose the next election, but give that person a chance, than not have fielded a candidate at all.
Who knows, the person may be just what Albany needs to spark movement towards a more perfect state government.
Chris, You know the budget
Chris,
You know the budget this year is an all Democrat show, with only the "3 men in a room", making the decisions. No Republicans are invited.
Maybe the solution is to give the Assembly to the Republicans for a change?
By the way, do you have a candidate yet to run against Hawley?
If a candidate running on our
If a candidate running on our Democratic line told the Albany Dems where to stick their advertising and lit money, what then?
If a candidate running on our Democratic line wanted to go to to Albany simply do do a good job for the people that elected him instead of spending two years planning his re-election campaign, what then?
If a candidate running on our Democratic line took money only from people he agreed with BEFORE he decided to run for office and therefore wasn't beholden to anyone or anything but a strong set of values and ideals, what then?
Your take on this is more defeatist than I care to put up with on a cold May morning. Your thinking on the matter seems to be: Might as well vote for the guy we've already got, he's useless but at least he's already there. It's that sort of attitude, and you're certainly not the only one who seems to have it, that prevents us from initiating meaningful change in the way Albany does business...or not.
There are 150 Assemblymen heading back to their districts this year telling their constituents: 'Hey, guys, it's not my fault, Albany is dysfunctional. Send me back and I'll get it fixed for you.'
Not a single one of them seems to understand that THEY ARE ALBANY. How many times can you pass the buck before the damn thing makes it all the way back to you?
Steve Hawley still has a section on his Assembly sponsored website griping about unfunded mandates. Here's a quote:
"Unfunded mandates are impositions on local governments and school districts, not only because they force mandates without helping to pay the cost but because, oftentimes, this forces our local governments to raise school or property taxes. I staunchly believe we need to reform our state's property tax system, and one way we can help local governments and homeowners alike is by stopping the unfunded mandates that come from Albany."
He must have forgotten about his 'staunch beliefs' a couple weeks ago when he CO-SPONSORED a piece of legislation that swung a big, fat, unfunded mandate wrecking ball right through our county budget. He could have fixed the problems with Leandra's Law during the drafting process, but instead he just signed up for whatever looked popular and voted 'Yes.'
We need to send someone to Albany who will actually read the legislation they're voting for, someone who can treat his Assembly seat as a full-time job and not just one of three or four hobbies that bring in a paycheck.
We need someone who's core principles won't allow him to engage in hypocrisy for the sake of popularity.
Most of all, we need someone who doesn't give a damn about being re-elected. A person who understands that a job done right, a vote according to principle and not popularity, is it's own reward.
This person is out there and it's up to us to send him to Albany to get the damn job done.
Chris, My questions was do
Chris,
My questions was do you have a candidate? I don't expect you to say who it is yet, but do you have one lined up? That's one of those "yes" or "no" type questions.
It's also the sort of answer
It's also the sort of answer you'll get right along with everyone else, John.
There will be no major elections news breaking on The Batavian this weekend. I will say that petition season begins on June 8th and I'm looking forward to it. There's a lot to be excited about in NY politics this year.
The answer speaks volumes.
The answer speaks volumes.
Chris, my attitude is only
Chris, my attitude is only defeatist if you believe the only answer is only answer is either A or B, either Republican or Democrat.
So long as the people who really care about reform and change do nothing more than support either Republicans or Democrats, nothing will ever change.
Bea, if you support a Democrat, you're supporting the status quo just as surely if you supported a Republican incumbent, or any incumbent.
As for electing somebody who will only take money from people he agrees with and won't take Albany Democrats money - how do you expect anybody to get elected who only has $1,000 bank account?
If you want to be effective, get out of the Democratic party, find some like-minded Republicans and independents and start the hard work of supporting somebody who actually has a chance of winning the district -- mostly likely a conservative/libertarian, not a progressive.
A true change candidate will be somebody who puts the interests of the district before party or Albany, and the only person who can do that is somebody doesn't belong to either party.
A true change candidate will
A true change candidate will be somebody who puts the interests of the district before party or Albany, and the only person who can do that is somebody doesn't belong to either party.
I couldn't agree more, Howard. We here in Genesee County, and Orleans, are nothing if not independent. If we want a representative who will represent us and not a party machine, that person will have to eschew both the Republocrat and Demican plutocracies. I was chastised by Mr Jeff Allen on this site a while ago for saying there's no point in supporting a candidate, because it always winds up sameo, sameo. He said that that's just the problem, too many think that way. I've thought about that, a lot since. (Yes, my life is boring) He's right. I'd love to see grassroot efforts start all over NY State to support candidates who will not accept the support of the 2 main parties. It could start right here, in Genesee County, we could be innovators. I really hate the notion that money elects people. I'm for common sense and a candidate who shows that he or she has it.
This entire discussion seems
This entire discussion seems polluted by the assumption that change is out of our reach. To assert that no one possesses the conscience to break out of Albany lockstep is the worst kind of defeatism. Purveyors of that notion only sanction the dysfunction they object to. Last November a single legislator could have broken rank and launched a new era in fiscal responsibility for our state. ...But we have yet to elect a person with that brand of responsibility.
Howard, I'd support an
Howard, I'd support an independent. I don't have to leave my party to do that.
There is change in the air, and I for one am very excited about the prospect of seeing new faces in Albany.
Not only from our district, but from other districts as well.
Change, C.M., is not out of reach.
I look forward to supporting a candidate who has the backbone to shoulder the job. Even if it is only for one term, the amount of good that could come from that term is not beyond the realm of possibility.
I think either C.M. or Phil
I think either C.M. or Phil should run.
Probably not both, since that would dilute the protest vote.
Bea said "I look forward to
Bea said "I look forward to supporting a candidate who has the backbone to shoulder the job. Even if it is only for one term, the amount of good that could come from that term is not beyond the realm of possibility."
Representatives, in theory, should be in the office out of a sense of duty, pride, and conviction. What we have instead are a bunch of career politicians who are perpetually running for office. It would take a major upheaval for there to be any change in Albany.
Let the upheaval begin!
Let the upheaval begin!
I'm with you on that one Bea!
I'm with you on that one Bea!
Bud, there is something to
Bud, there is something to be said for the ripple in the pond theory. If we can send somebody to Albany who is willing to bust some heads and maybe get his own head busted from time to time, we just might be able to start a trend...or at least make a statement.
Posted by Chris Charvella on
Posted by Chris Charvella on May 10, 2010 - 9:32am
Bud, there is something to be said for the ripple in the pond theory. If we can send somebody to Albany who is willing to bust some heads and maybe get his own head busted from time to time, we just might be able to start a trend...or at least make a statement.
Good morning, Chris.
Well said.
Chris, You have a point only
Chris,
You have a point only to the extent that if you send a Democrat to Albany who tries to "bust some heads", that means Assembly Leader, Mr. Silver. And Silver has a good track record of stomping out Democrats who challenge him and don't do what they are told. Very much like Joe Bruno did with Republicans who bucked him in the State Senate.
Sheldon Silver does what his
Sheldon Silver does what his job calls for, but he can't tell voters in the 139th what to do.
Chris, That's not what I
Chris,
That's not what I said. The voters here have nothing to do with Silver.
My point was that if you think that a Democrat, coming from here is going to "bust some heads", you're dreaming. Mr. Silver will bury him.
On the other hand, if a true 3rd party candidate was elected from here, that would send a message.
Yes, yes it would. That
Yes, yes it would. That candidate needs a major line though, otherwise we would be talking about a write in campaign.
Chris, Wrong, a third party
Chris,
Wrong, a third party candidate can run on their own line (harder to do), or on the line of a minor party (easier to do).
He/she does not need a write in campaign to run as a true independent.
and that line would be so far
and that line would be so far down the ballot no one would even know it was there.
There's nothing wrong with an independent or minor party candidate seeking the endorsement of a major party. If a candidate makes his/her values and intentions clear prior to an endorsement, there would be no reason to believe that those values would ever be compromised.
John, Taking in account all
John, Taking in account all available paths, only two get you to Albany. I'm not referring to I90 and I87. The nation is tracked by a two-party mentality. I became a member of the Green Party because a strong third party would dissolve gridlock. The bandwagon has yet to arrive.
Nobody cares, stop wasting
Nobody cares, stop wasting your time. Do something more productive with your time instead of wasting your lives with all this political babble. You smalltowners still don't get it. Nobody in Albany or Washington cares about redneck western NY or your elected officials. What you think or say is meaningless. Doesn't matter what party is in power or what politicians you vote in.
Chris, First, that means the
Chris,
First, that means the party could not find a member who wanted to run. Not that usual in this area.
Second, then the "independent" would be running on your line, against a lot of what your party stands for. It just makes it a bit hard to get money from the State party when you run against them. But they might close their eyes to try and beat a Republican, and then if he wins, bury him later in Albany.
It could be done and I hope Orleans County agrees and I wish you luck.
John, you're logic only
John, you're logic only works if you're assuming a candidate came to us. You're not taking into account the possibility that a non-traditional candidate was exactly what the doctor ordered this time around and that maybe we went looking for one. :)
Chris, Knowing you went
Chris,
Knowing you went looking for a Dem, at least at one time, I feel safe to think that after not finding one in Genesee County, you would also look around.
Do you know if Orleans County has a candidate? They have the last two times.
When I started the search,I
When I started the search,I had a short list of folks who I thought were the best people for the job, Dems and otherwise, traditional and non-traditional.
I wouldn't ever approach a person to run just to fill the ballot line. The person you're talking about would have been an excellent candidate and an even better Assembly member. I like to work both in and outside of the box though and, like I said earlier in the thread, there's a lot to be excited about this year.
Chris, Actually, your local
Chris,
Actually, your local Democrat party has done very well running people who were not registered Democrats. A good number of them won and some came close. That's something to go on.
above post edited
above post edited
Posted by John Roach on May
Posted by John Roach on May 10, 2010 - 2:29pm
Chris,
Knowing you went looking for a Dem, at least at one time, I feel safe to think that after not finding one in Genesee County,
Are you saying that there are no qualified Democrats in Genesee Co. to run?
Chris is a good foil for you, John. You want him to tip his hand and he won't. Keep baiting, though. It's fun to watch.
Thanks Howard.
Thanks Howard.
Bea, No, that's not what I
Bea,
No, that's not what I said. Try hard to get it right.
There are a lot of good Democrats who could run. But for one reason or another, they are not doing it.
As for "qualified", what does that mean?
And I am right that your party has had success running and winning with people who were not Democrats at the time they were nominated.
Everybody's so testy today...
Everybody's so testy today...
I'm still waiting for the
I'm still waiting for the 200,000 jobs Hilary Clinton promised us when she was our senator..