Drinking ban on public property in the city extended to picnic areas

Since WHEN is the Republican party the party of individual freedom ???? I thought the Republicans were the " let's go back in time" party - AGAINST civil rights - like blacks voting, like women's rights [see http://communities.washingtontimes.com/neighborhood/ad-lib/2011/mar/26/…] , like same-sex marriage, and so on.

This is the most stupid thing I can think of. The city council must not have anything else to do. I also want to know who made Councilman Frank Ferrando the wise one who rules over everyone in the city.
I would also like to know into what city coffer does the $25 go to? I know the city is hurting for revenue but $25 for a sheet of paper is a little too much.
Another reason why people are leaving the city and why the Town of Batavia would never vote to consolidate with the city.

LMAO @ permit....little by little they gonna strip us of our freedoms that our soldiers fought for!

The more laws made, the more lawless we become.

If I want to get drunk and go down the slides and swing on swings, that is my God-given right.

Jason, not any more.

Is this going to effect then when their is a wedding reception held at a park or birthday party or reunion. Alot of these go on at city parks. Are they now unallowed to have a drink at these events.

Have you read the book "1984'? In the very near future your home TV will be watchig you, if not already doing so. BIG BROTHER IS WATCHING.Do we just stand by and and let this happen? Wake up before it is to late.
What if you dont have a back yard to drink beer in? What then I might ask? Lets say your apartement complex has no provisions for outside dinning or socilizing and you and your friends/family want to have a couple beers and cook hot dogs. 25 bucks every time you want to do so! CRAZY

Liz, if you pay the $25.00 fee to rent the pavilion, you can drink.

This whole thing came up because a few council people did not like people sitting around having a beer. The people were not causing any problems, were behaving, and did not litter. They were just there too long for our new behavior watchdogs. The drinkers were just not the right kind of people.

Pass a new behavior control law, problem solved. Now only approved people will be at the park for hours.

Ron, some of these people who voted for this are running for election in November. Just remember to vote.

i don't drink but very little but i don't think its right, one more freedom taken away, as Jack said some of these people who voted for this are running for election in November. Just remember to vote.

This is nuts, so they pretty much are saying you can still drink just gotta pay me money? Either make it you can drink with rules and times. Or not at all. Another way you got us for our money. Just like NYS raising taxes on beer and pop? Are you JOKING?! What next raise taxes on oreos bc they are bad for you too? What about me, I am mom and live with my mother currently. The only person who watches my child is my mother. So i am going to have her watch my son and relax and have a drink where? lol At my home? I think the point of me asking her to watch him is to leave and relax and not pay $5 for 1 beer at a restaurant. You are more likely to drive to a restaurant and drink and drive then a park. Are you going to have to pay $20 before you do that too? This is the most ridiculous thing i ever heard of!

I heard brown paper bags are an effective tool in combatting enforcement.

If you keep your drink in a brown paper bag, police can't see it.

My question for council is how many people can apply for a permit to use a pavilion on the same day..Can the permit just be for myself.Can i have the whole pavilion for just me..Making it so other can't use it..So i can just sit there and drink..sounds like just another knee jerk rule the city lays on us..Remember the lady last month who was fine for parking in front of her house..the city's answer was to stop parking on that side all together..or when the city and GACSA deciede we can long smoke in the park that we pay taxes to the city to maintain..Thanks John and Dan for speaking up and for Rosemary Kathy and Sam..Whats next city council..Do you want us to only walk single file on Main Street..Like good little Lemmings do..When are you going to outlaw coffee drinking in the park..Thats a stimulant.....

@Mark, let's do it. I'll rent one side of a table and you rent the other. We'll play beer pong.

How many people can i have drink with me on my $25 permit? What happens if i hurt myself in the park after "buying" permission from the city to drink in OUR park? Will the city be liable?

Maybe the city should focus on getting the hoodlums out of Austin park before they tell the tax payers what they can't do there. Almost every time my kids, 15 and 12, go to Austin park they come back within 20 minutes because of "hoodlum" behavior going on.

Chris that is to funny...i'm in....

Remember that $25 absolves you from offending children who may see adults drinking. You can rent the pavilion; invite your entire family (including children) and drink as much as you like.
Children, not invited into the pavilion, can also witness the legal use of alcohol because the party paid their $25.00
Would it not be a better use of our tax money to have the police rid the parks of those causing trouble rather than impact the entire city with what amounts to a scuff law?
Mr Ferrando, I recall, held a birthday party for his mother in the community room at 400 Towers. They put up signs saying the room was off limits to residents because it was a private party. That party included alcohol beverages (at the time, residents of the Towers were not allowed to have alcohol in the public rooms or even outdoors). No money was paid to have a private party that prevented residents from entering THEIR community room.
Even now, if the room is used for a private function, one cannot stop other residents from entering the room.
I guess, Frank lives by the "do as I say, not as I do" motto.

I take it none of you have rented a shelter in a State Park in a while. This is hardly a novel idea.

Mr. Ferrando suggested that if you need to go to the park to drink, you might need professional help. i wonder, does that come with a permit?

How many people are allowed to drink in the pavilion on one permit? I had thought there was a limit on how much booze could be brought in as well.
City council reminds me of grade school, because one or two students were out of line, the whole class was punished.

Frank, nobody was out of line. The reason they gave last month when this was first brought up was that some people were staying too long. That's it. That bothered some of them.

And do you actually think that the police are going to monitor these parks. I really don't think they will.

John, were people complaining, or just city council?

Frank,
No member of the public came to council to complain and only council members said they had a personal issue with it. I bet if you ask now, a bunch will tell you they were getting complaints all the time.

Ridiculous!
This is what the council feels is their most important issue?

Does anyone know if we can get the e-mail addresses of the city council ? Then maybe we can send our complaints directly to them, because at a meeting you are given only 5 minutes and the concil doesn't even allow for open debate with the public. It seems to me that they are really scared to go face to face with the people of the city and hear that they are really out of touch with what people want from their elected officials.

So now it is okfor me to sit along Main Street on one of the benches having a Jack Daniels and a cigar but I can't do it in Austin Park where kids may see me. The city council is not now or ever was the moral compass and the parent of the city , they are there to assist in the running of the city, Stop trying to make us all regret living in Batavia.

Wayne, I'm pretty sure that sitting on a bench on Main St. drinking a Jack Daniels will get you a citation too.

Next will come the dress code law. You just know that someone on the council will have a problem with or be offended by the length of some girls shorts or the bare chest of some guy. Any guesses on how long that will take? How about someone's dog that barks too loud? Or, a child budging in line at a slide? Running too fast? Yelling too loudly? Looking to be having waaaay too much fun?? It's just a matter of time.

"We all vote our conscious". And you don't think politics has anything to do with it?

Shame, shame on you Mr. Ferrando......

Richard, you hit the nail on the head.

Richard, to fair to Ferrando, he had help passing this with Bob Bialkowski (4th Ward) and Bill Cox (1st Ward).

Just another case of disallowing the use of a park by law abiding citizens because of the misuse by a few. You can't single out the "misusers" in any way,shape ,or form because that would be discrimination. Aren't you all just warm & fuzzy now??

The scary part is two of them (Clattenbug and Ferrando) are running for county legislature. The worst part is I will be stuck with Clattenburg because no one is running against here. HEAVEN HELP US!!!!

For 5 bucks I ll let ya drink in my back yard...

yea ...i think its the bottom line...more ways to make money off of us...since they are so dependant on us...we pay them to make our lives miserable....doesnt make sense does it...they make laws in hopes to make money...sad that God put me on this planet to be enslaved by political diabolic leaders

Voting for different candidates doesnt absolve a dam thing....city council needs to find a more logical item to discuss...like job growth...(too late)...oh my mortgage went up btw...cuz..taxes went up LMAO...less money I will put into blahtavia...

Thanks, Mr. Roach for this information. When Mr. Cox comes to my home looking for his vote, while I'm on my front porch drinking beer, I'll remember this, or will I need a "PERMIT".

Ron i too have Mr.Cox here in the first ward..He tries to label himself as a conservitive and also runs as such.But yet he votes to either raise the city tax rate or come up with these restrictive rules to live under.....That i do not understand...He also decided to build his company in the town of Batavia in the new AG-Park,but at the same time voted to create a new Economic Agency Head here in Batavia..Why not go into the new Masse Mall he voted to give Mancuso money to create..

Firstly, I do not have anything negative to say about any member of council personally, but I do not think that this decision is going to do much besides give a hard time to law abiding citizens or young families who aren't bothering anyone by drinking a beer or a glass of wine. I said it at the Council meeting and I'll say it again, if someone is acting in a disorderly way, then they are guilty of disorderly conduct and should be removed from the park (alcohol or not). Many of the people who use the parks in my ward live near them and walk to or from them from their homes, I know this because I am one of those people. Our parks are a beautiful resource, our DPW does a wonderful job maintaining them and our police do a great job of keeping them safe, lets not run people out of them because they want to peacefully enjoy a beer there.
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Government, from local right up to the federal level was meant to govern, but only with bounds that respect people's rights, passing a law to remove people from the park because they are drinking while not bothering anyone, or, acting disorderly, is overstepping it's bounds. I don't think it's right and had I been on Council I would have voted no.

Our representatives in all levels of government should reflect on the old adage: "If it ain't broke- don't fix it!" Unfortunately, when confronted with the eventuality of problems- clearly "broke," they don't fix them. Why? Because the party bosses and special interest groups who manipulate/buy votes don't want those problems fixed. The "fix" would impede the progression of greed, constitute a 'loss of face' or violate some political sacred cow. So... Instead of fixing problems, politicians pass politically 'safe' laws that give the appearance of "doing their job" while the work they are elected to do never gets done. ...Or in the case of health care reform, job creation or deficit reduction, gets half (a**) done.

The Middle Class (if there really is such a thing) should get its act together and create a special interest lobby of its own. The Tea Party could have been such an organization, but it allowed itself to be co-opted by the GOP. Maybe if Americans bulldogged a legitimate force that actually promoted issues average Americans deemed important, the government (two parties) might accomplish something other than buttressing its self-image with 'feel good' legislation that costs taxpayers money and infringes on personal liberty.

CM maybe you are reading the Tea Party wrong..Maybe they are the ones who is going to be co-opting the GOP..not the other way around as you so state..

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How does this take away a personal freedom??? No individual owns the park, so they have no right to be mad about what is allowed in it. As a parent, I am glad to see that the city cares enough to ban certain behavior in PUBLIC areas. If someone wants to drink, why is it such a big burden to do it in their own space instead of in public space? Children have a right to go to parks and not have to see drunks while they are playing. This does happen whether complainers believe it or not. Having a party at a city maintained park should be considered a priveledge unless individuals plan to mow the lawn, pick up trash, and maintain the park. Stop complaining about losing freedom and look at the bigger picture. Substance abuse is a huge problem and it effects children and adults everyday. Do some research and you'll learn that growing up around consumption leads youth to believe it is ok, which can in turn increase the possibility of addiction. Go drink your beer in your own space!!

Tara - I understand where you are coming from, but someone drinking does not mean someone is acting disorderly. It is possible to have a beer without becoming rowdily drunk, and if someone is being rowdy or unreasonable then they can be charged with disorderly conduct and forced to leave. The park belongs to the citizens of Batavia, all of us, and we should be able to use the park to our liking so long as we aren't bothering anyone else or being obscene.....and I do not drinking a beer or a glass of wine is being obscene. The City has it's DPW to maintain the park, and we the citizens comprise the city. Parks are a right for citizens to use so long as our government pays for them.
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Many people also grew up around people consuming alcohol and have not become alcoholics. Should we ban tobacco so people will not become addicted? Cars so the environment doesn't become polluted? Of course not, we have standards for each of those things and we have them with alcohol consumption, it's disorderly conduct, it's a fair standard and one we should keep instead of outright banning alcohol consumption for those who may not have a backyard or can't afford to go to the bar.

Not just anyone will be able to get a 25 dollar permit, you can bet on that.
[video:http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ui_XH0GINPI]
Where will the riff raff go? To Texas, most likely.

Its pretty interesting that I got criticized by several people for having the drink in the park ban passed. For the record everyone, I was out of town on business for 3 days and was not even at the meeting. Therefore I did not vote and could not have voted.

For those who are interested I was originally in favor of the ban during our conference meeting. Since that time I spoke with several residents and as a result decided it infringed on people's rights too much. Dan Jones made a compelling argument which I read when I returned yesterday afternoon. Dan thinks thing through and often speaks out at council meetings. We need a lot more public comments on all topics. Public comments work, because it worked on me for this topic.

I would have made an amendment to ban proposal to eliminate glass containers in the park so we had no broken glass, but allow cans and kegs.

I welcome the input of any citizen in any ward at anytime to discuss any city topic. Before you jump the gun and tell others what you think I did, call me. I can be reached at 344-3914 (home) or my cell at 356-5430.

It would be nice if the people who made false comments about what I supposedly did, own up to them and publish a retraction. This will show what they are all about. We all make mistakes and what we do about them defines who we are.

Bill Cox
Councilman - First Ward

Bill, yes, you missed that meeting. But the month before (July) you went on record as being in favor of it and voted to fast track the law. It was the 3 Democrats who refused to allow the fast tracking, delaying the final vote for one month.

You could have told the council and public by letter of your opposition if you could not make the meeting, or could have asked another council person to at least mention it. If you had your way, this would have been law last month.

Also, glass is already not allowed in the parks, so your amendment would have been moot and nobody was suggesting kegs.

I look forward to your proposing a reversal of the law next month.

Posted by John Roach on August 10, 2011 - 6:54am

Richard, to fair to Ferrando, he had help passing this with Bob Bialkowski (4th Ward) and Bill Cox (1st Ward).

Making things up again?

Please tell me if I've got this right. If I want to consume a legal drink or smoke a cigarette in a city park I cannot because its not healthy for children to witness such behavior. Yet I can allow my dog to urinate on the grass where your children will be playing and that's OK? What we seem to be in need of is representatives with a little common sense. By the way I smoke (wish I didn't) and sometimes drink, and yet have been able to raise 3 wonderfully well adjusted daughters.

Bea, good try, but no. Both of them helped Frank pass this. Please read very carefully what I wrote. I did not say Bill was at the meeting, but he supported it and voted last month for the law to be fast tracked. It takes all 9 members to approve fast tracking and three voted no, so the final vote was delayed until this month. If they had not voted no, the law would have gone into effect in July.

I often go to Austin Park to walk Pachuco and see all ages, races, etc., enjoying the park, with the biggest draws of course being the playground and the water sprinklers. Most of the kids are so absorbed in their play and fun, I doubt they notice very little else unless it's right under their noses, like when my 160-pound rottweiler/Swiss mountain dog and I amble over to say Hi. I usually see parents watching their kids, and occasionally three or four people gathered here and there under the trees just hanging out. There is, or was, a regular contingency of folks, many wearing red (for what it's worth), who hang out in the pavilion and smoke cigarettes and drink beer. If a family picnic/birthday party wanted to use the space, I doubt anyone would stand in the way. The people I've spoken with at the pavilion have always been pleasant, coherent, easy-going, and most of them like my dog, too. A few weeks ago, before this new rule was approved, I saw two women in their 30s or 40s, peering through binoculars at the pavilion. They were standing by the sidewalk in front of the credit union and the senior housing building. They were, basically, spying on the people, who weren't causing trouble or being obnoxious. The women were all atwitter -- about who was there and how frequently they had seen the same people there, what were they doing now, what were they drinking, smoking? If this kind of "evidence" -- of what I know not -- can create new rules, I feel uneasy. (Gladys Kravitz and her chum Mrs. Grumbacher come to mind.) Pleasure police are ruthlessly nosy.

Trina....had to mention the dog didn't you. I feel a special meeting coming up....new rule...new rule....

bill you talked to some citizens about this issue?????LMAO!!!!!

This thread is now about ridiculously large fonts. Proceed.

OMG Councilman Frank Ferrando its 11:45 AM 08/11/2011 people are drinking in Austin Park call the SWAT team

How come no one spoke up in favor of it at the council meeting...Two people spoke against it....Does our input really matter to those on council..

I bring my book to the park and one of those tall transparent thermal mugs filled with ice and a clear non alcoholic beverage. Will I be asked to uncap the thermal mug to prove that my beverage meets the law? Will law abiding citizens be searched to make sure they aren't breaking the law?

Mark - I have spoken to 2 people who are for it, and at least 30 or 40 who without me asking tell me they are against it. There was no public campaign that prompted this, nor does there seem to be much support community wide for it if the comment threads on The Batavian and the Daily News are any indication.

Bea - Make sure you don't light up a cigarette with your 'liqour stew', you'll be doing double duty on fines.

lol, Dan. It is "drunk steak", not liquor stew. Can you imagine trying to explain that the alcohol in the beer evaporated leaving only the flavor of the grain and hops?
Maybe the investigating officer can finally find out what happens to all the onions that go into that dish. They disappear long before serving.

Bea, Frank said if you have to go to the park to drink, you might need help. Besides, he told you to use your backyard. Oh, that's right, your apartment complex have a backyard?

John
Since the amount of alcohol I consume in the course of a year can be measured by the ounce, this is really a non issue for me. I do use wine, beer, and other spirits in cooking - ergo - "drunk steak" and other appetizing dishes that are enhanced by the flavor imparted by said beverages.
The complex has a front yard, facing Main St., and a back yard that parallels Swan St. To my knowledge, rarely will you find residents imbibing on either lawn.