BTW: Before the proposal to add 20K agents to the border patrol was added to immigration reform, what group do you think was the biggest opposition to immigration reform?
omg....yes voters are so scared......20,000 more cops......if you really think they will be watching the border, you got another thing coming.......
i'm thinking, 1/3 population is cop....1/3 population is incarcerated....1/3 population is serf to other 2/3's
stop and think for a minute....unlike the u.s. military,the 20,000cops can fire on and kill americans if ordered to, ......it's common knowledge the federal government has been stock piling ammunition and automatic weapons.......if you think they are doing this to protect you, again, you got another thing coming....
tell me yes voters, what are you so afraid of? dying?
death comes to us all.
1 Conservative right here Howard. In vesting in securing our borders from terrorists, smugglers, and illegals makes a HELL of a lot more sense than "investing" in a myriad of failed alternative energy pipe dreams, foreign aid to our enemies (like the muslim brotherhood), hiring thousands of IRS agents to support obamacare, and research on the sexual behavior of the North American tree frog!
Explain to me exactly how securing our borders is a waste of money? Are you suggesting we remove all border security efforts as it is a waste of money?
Maybe you're right, Howard. We should. While we're at it, why not dissolve ALL forms of law enforcement? That's probably a waste also, isn't it? Except DOJ of course. They have to keep us law abiding citizens in check - we may actually want to utilize some old and outdated constitutional rights - you know that 1st and 2nd amendment garbage? Unless, of course the 1st amendment is one of your pet projects.
If you think I'm not a law and order kind of guy, you haven't been paying very close attention.
I see no evidence that 20K more border agents are needed. I see no evidence that 10 more border agents are needed.
What I see is a broken immigration system that makes it too hard for workers to come to the US for jobs.
We don't need bigger government. We need more freedom, less spending, lower taxes, fewer intrusions into the market place. Those are traditional conservative values. I always find it disappointing that conservatives have abandoned those bedrock, core values.
Kyle's comment starts to tread into personal attack mode (against the rules) by suggesting somebody isn't educated ... but since the comment clearly misunderstands the prior comment, and others have already responded to it, I'm not deleting it (if it was more demeaning, or if the thread had gotten out of control by the time I saw it, then maybe ...)
At any rate, there was a clear name calling violation and that comment was removed.
Howard, your post of 7:36 makes much more sense and is an arguable point. Thank you.
I agree with most of what you said in this one, but submit to you that border security is much more closely related to our national security then the economy.
We are in 75% agreement that government on ALL levels is bloated, over reaching, dysfunctional, and corrupt. You yourself, though, have said in the past that we should keep our noses out of other country's business. That goes both ways. If we should not be the world's police, neither should we be responsible for taking care of their poor and unemployed.
I submit to you that there are literally thousands of cuts in programs and personnel that would save many times the cost of finally securing the border. In addition to cuts, opening up our exploration and utilization of our own energy resources (including fracking) will adress 80% of our economic woes AND make us energy independent - not reliant on our enemies for oil.
I still dont see it David..... Do you know any police personally. Since my comprehension has been put into question, lets ponder the 2nd half of your ridiculous statement...
stop and think for a minute....unlike the u.s. military,the 20,000cops can fire on and kill americans if ordered to, ......it's common knowledge the federal government has been stock piling ammunition and automatic weapons.......if you think they are doing this to protect you, again, you got another thing coming....
Now lets look at the headlines, how many law enforcement officials have come out and said if ordered to they will NOT confiscate weapons from private individuals. So the image you project of blindly loyal cops is pure fantasy. Also cops live in the community and have friends and family there. Do you think they could do this and still face themselves. Its the same as ordering the military to turn and use force on the general public.... they will defy it mostly because the oath they all took was to support and defend the Constitution of the United States, not the govt or political leaders.
BTW The population of the US last year was 319 Million people. So lets take your 20,000 cops and make it 2 million cops. hmmmmm 319 vs 2
And sorry Howard...the ingnorance comment was meant to be snarky and sarcastic, I thought it placement was more a generalization then a directed attack. I apologize.
The point of arguing about the logistics of the bill is moot already. The bill has swelled to over 1200 pages. NOT ONE legislator will be able to read or even come close to fully comprehending what is in it. It has already become Stimulus, Obamacare, have to pass it to see what's in it, bloated, pork filled (Harry Reid has stuffed it with $$ after petitioning to have Nevada classified as a border state), sleight of hand legislation. The actual building of the fence, securing and staffing of the border has already been found to be window dressing implemented (if at all) at the discretion of Janet Napolitano. Even with passage, the fence, the agents, and a secure border were only cursory additions to garner bi-partisan support. It is far more likely that the funds will be allocated, then reapportioned to some other government blackhole. I voted NO
Thanks, Jeff ... this is exactly what I mean about big government ... you don't get what you think you're getting ... and to support it, even under the guise of "border security" is to just feed the beast.
I can't see supporting more big government in any of its manifestations.
Fortunately there are a few legislators out there actually doing their jobs and uncovering the atrocities of this bill. Watch the link below for a WHOPPER. You only need to watch the first 7 mins. to get the worst part.
As it stands, 71 percent say
As it stands, 71 percent say yes -- where are all the anti-tax, anti-bloated government conservatives?
BTW: Before the proposal to
BTW: Before the proposal to add 20K agents to the border patrol was added to immigration reform, what group do you think was the biggest opposition to immigration reform?
http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2013/05/20/major-ice-union-against-…
omg....yes voters are so
omg....yes voters are so scared......20,000 more cops......if you really think they will be watching the border, you got another thing coming.......
i'm thinking, 1/3 population is cop....1/3 population is incarcerated....1/3 population is serf to other 2/3's
stop and think for a minute....unlike the u.s. military,the 20,000cops can fire on and kill americans if ordered to, ......it's common knowledge the federal government has been stock piling ammunition and automatic weapons.......if you think they are doing this to protect you, again, you got another thing coming....
tell me yes voters, what are you so afraid of? dying?
death comes to us all.
1 Conservative right here
1 Conservative right here Howard. In vesting in securing our borders from terrorists, smugglers, and illegals makes a HELL of a lot more sense than "investing" in a myriad of failed alternative energy pipe dreams, foreign aid to our enemies (like the muslim brotherhood), hiring thousands of IRS agents to support obamacare, and research on the sexual behavior of the North American tree frog!
It's a big sop to organized
It's a big sop to organized labor, Bob. A massive waste of money. But I guess you're OK with wasting money if it's one of your pet causes.
Explain to me exactly how
Explain to me exactly how securing our borders is a waste of money? Are you suggesting we remove all border security efforts as it is a waste of money?
Maybe you're right, Howard. We should. While we're at it, why not dissolve ALL forms of law enforcement? That's probably a waste also, isn't it? Except DOJ of course. They have to keep us law abiding citizens in check - we may actually want to utilize some old and outdated constitutional rights - you know that 1st and 2nd amendment garbage? Unless, of course the 1st amendment is one of your pet projects.
Bob, there's a point of
Bob, there's a point of diminishing returns.
If you think I'm not a law and order kind of guy, you haven't been paying very close attention.
I see no evidence that 20K more border agents are needed. I see no evidence that 10 more border agents are needed.
What I see is a broken immigration system that makes it too hard for workers to come to the US for jobs.
We don't need bigger government. We need more freedom, less spending, lower taxes, fewer intrusions into the market place. Those are traditional conservative values. I always find it disappointing that conservatives have abandoned those bedrock, core values.
Hey david, I think you need a
Hey david, I think you need a math refresher, you wrote...
i'm thinking, 1/3 population is cop....1/3 population is incarcerated....1/3 population is serf to other 2/3's
Thats 1/3 +1/3 +1/3 plus the 2/3 of the population the last third is serf to...
that equals 5/3rds, pretty good addition there LOL
David, save your money
David, save your money towards the (suggested) math refresher.
Instead, maybe we'll all kick in a little for Kyle's reading-comprehension.
No name calling (there was a
No name calling (there was a comment deleted).
Kyle's comment starts to tread into personal attack mode (against the rules) by suggesting somebody isn't educated ... but since the comment clearly misunderstands the prior comment, and others have already responded to it, I'm not deleting it (if it was more demeaning, or if the thread had gotten out of control by the time I saw it, then maybe ...)
At any rate, there was a clear name calling violation and that comment was removed.
Howard, your post of 7:36
Howard, your post of 7:36 makes much more sense and is an arguable point. Thank you.
I agree with most of what you said in this one, but submit to you that border security is much more closely related to our national security then the economy.
We are in 75% agreement that government on ALL levels is bloated, over reaching, dysfunctional, and corrupt. You yourself, though, have said in the past that we should keep our noses out of other country's business. That goes both ways. If we should not be the world's police, neither should we be responsible for taking care of their poor and unemployed.
I submit to you that there are literally thousands of cuts in programs and personnel that would save many times the cost of finally securing the border. In addition to cuts, opening up our exploration and utilization of our own energy resources (including fracking) will adress 80% of our economic woes AND make us energy independent - not reliant on our enemies for oil.
I still dont see it
I still dont see it David..... Do you know any police personally. Since my comprehension has been put into question, lets ponder the 2nd half of your ridiculous statement...
stop and think for a minute....unlike the u.s. military,the 20,000cops can fire on and kill americans if ordered to, ......it's common knowledge the federal government has been stock piling ammunition and automatic weapons.......if you think they are doing this to protect you, again, you got another thing coming....
Now lets look at the headlines, how many law enforcement officials have come out and said if ordered to they will NOT confiscate weapons from private individuals. So the image you project of blindly loyal cops is pure fantasy. Also cops live in the community and have friends and family there. Do you think they could do this and still face themselves. Its the same as ordering the military to turn and use force on the general public.... they will defy it mostly because the oath they all took was to support and defend the Constitution of the United States, not the govt or political leaders.
BTW The population of the US last year was 319 Million people. So lets take your 20,000 cops and make it 2 million cops. hmmmmm 319 vs 2
I wonder who would bet on the 2?
And sorry Howard...the
And sorry Howard...the ingnorance comment was meant to be snarky and sarcastic, I thought it placement was more a generalization then a directed attack. I apologize.
The point of arguing about
The point of arguing about the logistics of the bill is moot already. The bill has swelled to over 1200 pages. NOT ONE legislator will be able to read or even come close to fully comprehending what is in it. It has already become Stimulus, Obamacare, have to pass it to see what's in it, bloated, pork filled (Harry Reid has stuffed it with $$ after petitioning to have Nevada classified as a border state), sleight of hand legislation. The actual building of the fence, securing and staffing of the border has already been found to be window dressing implemented (if at all) at the discretion of Janet Napolitano. Even with passage, the fence, the agents, and a secure border were only cursory additions to garner bi-partisan support. It is far more likely that the funds will be allocated, then reapportioned to some other government blackhole. I voted NO
Thanks, Jeff ... this is
Thanks, Jeff ... this is exactly what I mean about big government ... you don't get what you think you're getting ... and to support it, even under the guise of "border security" is to just feed the beast.
I can't see supporting more big government in any of its manifestations.
Howard, is there no way
Howard, is there no way someone can DELETE their OWN comment? Or can they only edit it?
Fortunately there are a few
Fortunately there are a few legislators out there actually doing their jobs and uncovering the atrocities of this bill. Watch the link below for a WHOPPER. You only need to watch the first 7 mins. to get the worst part.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=26o-pAeu63w